Cultures, Traditions and Countries

[didem]

Hey you all,

Since we are all from different countries and cultures, I thought it would be fun and informative and interesting if we talk about our countries' cultures and traditions or the countries themselves (climate, biggest cities, historical places, misconceptions, whatever you think worth mentioning about your country). (Nazifa, you should tell us about both Afghan and Dubai cultures, you are like two persons in one heheh )

Every culture has different traditions, holidays, wedding customs etc. You don't have to tell everything all at once. Just whenever you think of something that is special in your country, just come here and tell us. We talked about ourselves, it would be insightful to know about each others culture.

So to start,

Turkey. It is not a dessert. We don't even have a dessert, and no camels here. Although I feel it would be interesting if we have those, they are cute
Yes the official religion is Islam, but not every woman wears turban as it is shown in a lot of foreign made movies. That is not an obligation as you can see in my picture but a choice made by the woman herself. (or sometimes the father/the husband). (I am not criticizing, just correcting the misconception)
We have a mixed culture like US. People have different origins. And every region has its own traditions. Some are extreme, some are minor differences.
Istanbul is like the capital city (it is not, Ankara is the capital city, but Istanbul feels like it) It is big, it's crowded. You can find anything you are looking for there. For fun, or to buy, or to see. There are Ottoman palaces, and historical places, lots of mosques, churchs, concert areas, every kind of pubs, restaurants etc.
In Mediterranian and Aegean regions, there are lots of vacation places, they are heaven.
In Black sea region, you mostly see forests. It rains a lot. It's where the nuts and the tea grows.
East is hot.
The middle (that is where I am) is the mix of everything minus the sea

About traditions. I can think of a few at the top of my mind.
A wedding custom. Nazifa and Farah may know of it. We don't have bachelor or bachelorette parties but we do have this. The night before the wedding is the henna night. Henna is a green substance. When you put it on your hand and wait a little it colors your hand to orange. The more you wait the darker the shade. The shape of it depends on how you put it on your hand. Most people do it as a circle. But I've seen ones in heart shape So that night all the girls get together, the bride-to-be is the center of attention. The goal is to make her cry before leaving her home. So, the lights are switched off. The ladies light candles and make a circle around the bride who is sitting and her face is closed with a head scarf. The ladies begin to circle around the bride singing songs about leaving home, not seeing your family. Until the bride cries. If she stubbornly doesn't cry, ladies keep circling and singing. But naturally not only the bride but the close persons to the bride all cry a lot. Then they put the henna on the bride's hands and all others' who want to have it. Then the party begins. They play music and dance. It is a fun night. But I wouldn't do it. It's not my thing.

We do have a thing for marriage proposals. Arranged marriages are rare in Turkey now. But even though you find your own love and decide to get married, his family comes to your family's house with flowers and chocolate and ask your family's permission to take you for their son. It is a tradition thing now, I mean if you've already decided, nobody says no at that ceremony But that way the families get to know each other and they also honor the tradition so they feel good. At that ceremony, the bride to be prepares Turkish coffee (a different kind of coffee, it is more strong and is drunk in little amounts) and put salt rather than sugar into the groom-to-be's coffee. Groom-to-be shouldn't make a sound, that means he can take the bride for better or for worse, even if she fails he could tolarate her. If he makes a negative sound like shout or something families think he is not patient enough for their girl and can lose his patience with her. Of course, today they are all symbolic stuff and don't change anything. But it's always fun to watch the groom-to-be's face when he first drinks it. Even if he expects it he can't fully control his facial expressions and to see that is always priceless

There is the "Asure week" Asure is a desert made of almost everything you can think of. Beans, chickpea, raisin, water, sugar. It sounds like gross I know but it's not In Asure week, women make lots of asure at their home then give them out to their neighbours. They don't need to know you, they don't expect you to give them your own asure. They just do it. It's fun. Last year we got two of them. And we don't know the neighbours

In Turkey, we hug when we see a person, and kiss two cheeks. If we've just met, of course we just shake their hand, but otherwise...
And elderly... We kiss the hands of the elderly. Then put it to our forehead. It's a respect thing. If we don't do that, they decide we are not respectful enough, so we do it to humor them. At least I am doing it to humor them

These are all I can think of now. I'll write when I think of new stuff So tell me about your countries/customs/traditions?

[Nazifa Jan]

Thanks for opening the thread, Didem.
Here I go now:

I'll start off with Afghanistan because that's my nation originally.
Past: Afghanistan was once (long back) what USA is today. Girls walking around freely. Educated. Stylish clothes. Mini dress/skirts. Jeans. They smoked & drank alcohol. (These were opted by those who chose too, of course, no one defined or commanded them how or what to wear and all) Simply, they had choice & freedom.
After many invasions, and outrageous laws (these laws had nothing to with Islam despite their claims), these all stopped. Oppression. Sexism. Racism. Tribes fighting tribes. Wars. Simply put, disaster.

Present time: However, these (above negative stuffs like wars and all) has again reduced. I know that Kabul (the capital city) has both its urban and rural areas. There are malls, hospitals, stalls, cinemas, parks. Similar to any other country. My sister even said that shops in Kabul have more unique and stylish clothes compared to Dubai. Also, that they are more expensive.
Last time, I visited Afghanistan was when I was 7. I remember that I disliked staying in Kabul. It was pretty crowded & all. But, Parwan, the countryside is simply magnificent. Mountains, rivers, stables, forests, greenery. It was beautiful. Parwan has a very special place in my heart. ♥

Gender: Boys are still, by majority, held at esteem. Having heirs are vital for Afghans. Thankfully, modern minded Afghans stop practicing this. *Yay*
Men still have authority and a dominating role in the family. Sad, I know. But this may vary for some families, of course.

Religion: Islam is the nation's religion. I've hardly heard of any Afghan Christians or Jews. [I think there are only 2 Afghan Jews known from what I've heard my Papa say.]
My parents, however, NEVER forced religion on me. At the age of 13 or 14, I searched religions briefly. But I always believed in ONE God. Islam was always there for me. (The media just brainwashed me for awhile). I actually consider myself a convert to Islam. He he. I was born to a Muslim family but I CHOSE Islam myself. Hijab, prayer, fasting. . .none was ever pushed upon me. I was guided to it. Alhamdulillah (Praise is to God).

Food:National food is "Kabuli". Rice mixed with raisins, chicken, carrot. There is also typical foods like "manto" which is dumpling filled with meat, "shorwa" which is soup filled with meat, potato, bread.
We, Afghans, simply love chai (tea). It's our oxygen!

Weddings:Other than the Islamic marriage (nikah), we have a grand wedding for our huge families. We usually organise it in a ball room @ a hotel. Girls and guys are in separate ballrooms. The bride wears white gown, puffed up; just like a princess. Sometimes, they even wear tiaras or crowns. They have a full week parlor treatments with beauty care and waxing & all. The bride simply just sits on a decorated stage on a fancy chair. Btw, she is adorned with ridiculous amount of gold. It even reaches up to their knee sometimes. Afghan ladies are fanatics over gold sets. *sigh*
For entertaining the guests, there are dance performances (which I find boring because it's not like a hyper performance like how desi people, Indians and Pakistanis, have). The groom arrives after a while wearing tuxedos. We usually do a have flower girls, and red carpet when the couple arrives.
Traditionally, there is this game the couple plays. The bride closes her fist and the groom must trying opening it. I guess, it's a power of strength, don't really know its significance. There is this another tradition: For slicing the wedding cake, a member of either the bride or groom's family dance with the sword for which in return of getting the knife back, the groom has to pay money to retrieve it. (My mom did it in my uncle's wedding but she returned it without taking any money from him ) And of course, no bachelor parties. We have pre-wedding sweets distributing to a gazillion households. Very tiring! There is henna ceremony the night before the wedding. One week after the wedding, there is an all girls party. Food is provided and guests dance, eat and gossip. -.-
And the couple also dances.

Dance:Attan. Form a circle. Clap while rotating. And one by one, someone joins the center & does some fancy dance moves.

Marriage proposal:The guy's mother calls the girl's mother. They talk it over. If the girl's mother agrees, then only is the proposal discussed with the men of the family. Girls consent is taken, at least from the open-minded families.

Dowry:As per Islam, guy hands over dowry to the girl. Thank God! Imagine giving away your daughter as well as dowry to the guy!?

[Nazifa Jan]

I'll write Dubai's separately.
Actually, UAE is the country, Dubai is the city. But I know most people are familiar to this nation as 'Dubai'.

I've lived here for 16 years. It's more of a man-made developed nation. It was a desert before. After the discovery of oil, voila, the country boosts up. There are A LOT of malls, parks, manmade islands, skyscrapers, restaurants. I'd call it a "City of Glamour".

Women wear abaya. Which is a black kind of coat. It varies for modesty reasons to just fashion statements. Of course, girls are free to wear jeans, dress, skirts or whatever they want to. But you'll see mainly the local women wearing abaya.

Men's traditional wear is kandura. Which is a white long dress-looking thing.

Islam is the nation's religion. But there is diverse religions too. Like there are churches, temples etc. Residents are free to follow their own religion.

Alcohol is served in Dubai but it is banned in Sharjah [another city in UAE]. Dubai is modern in that way. There are pubs, discos, bars etc etc in Dubai; which are all banned in Sharjah.

National bird is falcon. Locals here also LOVE horse riding.

Instead of presidency, the country has Sheikhs [kind of like royal families in England].

Dubai currently holds the position of having the tallest tower in the world, Burj Khalifa.

Sadly, I do not know much about their insights like their weddings, food, lifestyle.

In my opinion, Dubai is just a simple developed city filled with glamour and manmade beauty. It's a safe city. Well provided for.
But I miss the nature and scenic of the countryside when I am here. . . .

[FarahN]

Ahhh start of a great topic. Way to go didem!

I love what you both have written about your respective countries. it sounds amazing!

Ok now abt my country hmm..let's see.. Pakistan itself is not a huge country but its big enough. It's bordered by china, Afghanistan, India and Iran on four sides. yey Nazifa we're neighbours ..

Pak is divided into 4 provinces that are: Sind, Punjab, Baluchistan and North west frontier province aka NWFP. All the four regions have lots of cities in them. These 4 provinces have their own languages but Urdu is our national language and everyone understands it. There are some basic cultures and traditions that all provinces have but there are sum extreme and sum not so extreme cultures that are their own. Of course since Pakistan was divided from the subcontinent and was also under the British rule for a while, we have adopted some Indian and sum English cultures as well. the 4 provinces also differ climate and land wise. For example Sind and Baluchistan are in south. And Punjab and NWFP are in north. Baluchistan is a desert and very very hot. Sind is half desert and half green so weather differs from city to city. Punjab has a better climate and is very green. Has mountains and 5 rivers and also experiences snowfall in some areas. NWFP has a colder drier climate. It's a moutainous area. Experiences lots of snow.

The complexions and features of people living in these 4 provinces are quite different too. Hehehe for example in Baluchistan since its so hot mostly people are dark complexioned.. They have curly dry hair.and dark eyes.. In Sind, we have all kinds of ppl. Dark, wheatish, fair and extremely fair. There are dark eyes and light coloured eyes. Different hair colours too. I personally know red heads, blondes, and brunettes people in Sind have less tendency to be fat. And anyone who is stands out. Punjab however has a lot of overweight people. They are also tall and mostly fair of skin. There are many people with coloured eyes. Now in NWFP you might get mistaken and think u landed in America :p everyone is white WHITE and they have coloured eyes. and different hair colours. Only since NWFP is so dry people have really early ageing skin

I live In Karachi that is in Sind and is the largest city in Pakistan. It's a huge metropolitan just like Istanbul. Although Islamabad that is in Punjab is the capital, Karachi feel more like it. It's a very happening place. It has a lot of different people living in it. U can't look at one person and know immediately where he or she is from. Like in Punjab a foreigner would stand out whereas in Karachi we take everyone in our fold.. It makes the city so colourful so since there are different sets of people living we have a very strong cultural flavour too. And guess what? Karachi is a coastal city so we have the big Arabian Sea!! we have the ports too of course and that's why Karachi is the business and industrial hub of Pakistan.

Our normal dress code is this long shirt that we call a kameez and the pants are are loose and called shalwar. It's not a rule to cover your head or cover your body with those cloaks like in Saudi Arabia but some women for whatever reason choose to or again like didem said their husbands or fathers make them. I don't wear that cloak or the head dress and neither does anyone in my family . The clothes are slightly changed now too. Many people weAr western attire in favour of the traditional one. I'm comfortable with both as long as I'm not showing too much skin. So no tiny shirts and no sleeveless. And no shorts hahha. We take this stole that's called a dupatta. We sort of drape it across our necks and chest.. The idea is to cover the chest. Many people forgo this, but I don't. I take a stole even if I wear anything western

Since its a an Islamic republic of Pakistan by law we are basically a Muslim majority state. We do have minorities living though, Christians, Hindus, Sikhs, Zoroastrians and such. And we do have their temples and prayer places, churches and all built too.

The staple food is rice and wheat. So many people include both of them In Their meal at once. Mostly though, there are lighter vegetable based foods for lunch and meat based ones for dinner. We cook our food either vegetable or meat in curry form. It's more liquidy than a normal gravy since its water based. And we call it salan we eat it with this bread made of wheat that's called roti. Roti is made just like u make the Mexican flour tortilla. U knead and roll the dough and then u flatten it by the rolling pin and slap it onto a heated flat iron pan. It rises and cooks and then you eat your Salan by dipping the bite sized pieces of roti that you break into it.

Hmmm now about marriage proposals. It's pretty Victorian lol just like I mentioned before. Mostly marriages are arranged by parents. The girl n boy do consent of course. Now though, the trend is changing and there are many love matches too. So in Arranged marriages this is how it goes: We have clans in our country.. And we have our 'ton' too. different sets of tons for different clans there are weddings in the clan or big get togethers or parties. In those gatherings the guy's parents and especially moms and sisters are on the lookout for a girl they would like for their marriageable aged son :p some times they try to covertly show the girl they would like to propose for their son to the guy himself.
Then the boys mom would somehow find the girls moms number and call her up and say that they would like to come to their place and see the girl. If and when the girls mom consents, the boys sisters and mother would come to the girls house to see how the girl looks in her normal surroundings, how she serves them and stuff. They talk to her a bit to see a bit of her thoughts and her talking style. Lol.( I laughingly call them the X-ray team) since they really really thoroughly look the girl over ugh it's embarrassing and awkward at times. *phew*

Anyway, if and when they like the girl. They call the mom back and say our family would like to meet your family. This means the boy, his father and brothers also come for a visit. So both families meet each other. The girls family is also present. Now everybody is examining everybody hahahahaha

If the boy and his family likes the girl n her family, the boys mom calls back a few days later, few months too sometimes and says that they wanna come over to give a formal proposal. Then they come and present the girls family with all the details on the boy n their family and say that we will ask your decision in A few days time.

The girls family investigates the boys family thoroughly. They meet the family again. They meet the boy again too with And also without his family to see how he acts In Different situations. Basically I think the whole process tops the Spanish Inquisition Lolx thank God I'm not a boy hehehe
If the girls family likes everything, they say yes to the boys mom when she calls to ask for answer. Then there is an engagement in which rings are exchanged and wedding dates are fixed.

The weddings are extravagant affairs. Of course depends on how much the girls family can afford. There is lots of yummy food and lots of flowers and people. they are mostly segregated affairs in which men n women sit separately divided by a non see through screen. These days though, the trends are changing. Many people don't have any segregation. The raised platform or stage as we call it is always in the women's section of course. Just like Nazifa said, our brides are supposed to look decorated and pretty and sit on that stage and smile. Hehehe

they start preparing for their wedding day at least a month before. With waxings, facials, massages, skin tone lighteners and blah blah what not :p (i should mention here, that in Pakistani society everyone likes a person who is fair of skin and tall. *roll my eyes* so when the boys mom looks for girls for her son, she always tries to choose a fair skinned and tall girl. The dark ones have trouble procuring proposals through arranged systems. Sad fact. The girls who aren't fair are forever trying out fairness products and stuff. They are always made to feel less important if they're not white. i guess this comes from being ruled over by the british for more than 100 yrs. everyone wants to be fair like them) so the beauty regimens that the brides try to follow is also to look fairer if they're not already that skin tone on their big day on which she goes and gets ready from a beauty salon.( I'm thank God fair of skin and also tall. So I've never been stereotyped or made to feel less than wat I am. But I've seen my friends suffer *sigh* )
Anyway. There is a henna ceremony a night before but since we have huge henna parlours, the ladies from those parlours are hired to come apply it to the brides hands and feet and also the closest cousins and female relations. The designs are very intricate and pretty. the girl and her family do cry heheh there's always a crying session :p and there is music and dancing and singing. Some families look down on the dancing unless its contained within the female section. They don't like the fact that girls are dancing and all men can watch :p but there are different ways to have fun. Staying up late at nights with cousins and friends. Talking, staging theatrics, telling jokes and stuff. And ribbing the bride about her adolescence embarrassments :p heheh

The love marriages also have the same kinda wedding ceremonies but the girl tells her parents that she likes a boy. Tells them about him n his family. Sometimes the girls parents meet the boy before saying ok send your parents and sometimes the boys parents call the girls parents and come to meet and bring proposal. The girls parents can still refuse if they want to but normally, these things are decided before the boys parents propose. So all goes well. My dad was against love matches so I always used to wonder how I was gonna break the news to him that I like a guy enuf to marry him :p let's just say it never came to that :s

Hmmm I've written a saga. Maybe I should write a book on this :p hehehe ok what's left? Lemme see...
Yeh like didem said, when we meet someone we hug and kiss on both cheeks. If we are meeting someone for the first time, sometimes we just shake hands or kiss one cheek. Depends form person to person. Of course all this is reserved for meeting someone female or your first cousins hehehe. Not men. When we meet our elderly we just hug and kiss them the same way we do normally. But whenever we meet anyone at all we always say Assalam o Alaikum that's the Muslim way of greeting to which the person replies Walaikum Assalam. The first means, may God be with u and keep u safe and the second is said in reply and means you too. These are the rough translations
Many young people forgo this in favour of hi and hello or hey.. But u can never greet a person who is older than u like that or they would really think that you're disrespectful :p

Soooo my dearies.. Looks like it will take u longer to read than it took me to write :p I've been writing since yesterday in bits n pieces hahahahaha. Ask me anything that I've missed I'll tell u more if I can remember..

Oh yeh. Normally kids live at home with their parents until they're married. Even if they're in their 20s or 30s. The girls are of course married off. And the boys bring home wives. If the house is big enuf and they're comfortable the boy n his wife live in the family home which is of course divided into sections to accommodate the growing family or some boy siblings decide to get their own place near their parents. But there are weekly get togethers. Sometimes twice too. The joint family system still exists. But more and more married people are opting to live alone rather than with in laws

I think this is it for now. :p enjoy!

[didem]

Thanks for the answers girls. They are long and perfect. But for other time.
Unfortunately I can't read them right now. I am too distracted with what's been happening in Turkey.
Here is a summary of what's been going on: For four days now, police have been brutalizing protesters who wanted to save an important and historical park in Istanbul. It started really small. When they attacked the small group of sleeping protesters at the park with excessive force (they used tear bombs, they burned their tents), the Turkish people all around the country has just snapped. There are millions of people out there protesting the dictotarian rulings of the prime minister at almost every city now. And police is brutalizing all of them with water cannons, tear bombs, rubber bullet weapons etc. I was there yesterday. We all were exposed to the tear gas without any provocation. Today I am home, watching it from the TV, wanting to be there. There are of course a small group of provocateurs who want to steer people in their direction and make it look like a different protest but the majority of the poeple out there are just students, teachers, housewives, fathers, mothers, mp's of other political parties, actors, actresses, showmans in short people who want their democratic rights. The Turkish mainstream media are not broadcasting the news, when they do they try to make us look like terrorists. So we tried to spread it to the world's media via social media. And they are now broadcasting the news; CNN International, BBC World, New York Times, Reuters if you want to follow up. It will going to get worse because it gets better. So wish us luck!

See you around when I can focus on your messages!

[Nazifa Jan]

@Farah:Our culture is VERY similar! Almost 98% match. :p
Most of the stuffs you wrote, I was already familiar with them. BECAUSE of my Pakistani friends.
And you mentioned "ideal girls by Paki elder women". . . .it is so similar to "ideal girls by Afghan elder women"!
The characteristics of their ideal girl are: tall, VERY fair, big eyed, thin [not fit, thin], black hair, long nose.
Seriously! This is. . .ridiculous. -.-
Btw, I've worn shalwar kameez before when I was a child. But once my elder sister, in a joking way, remarked that I don't look nice in it. I was a kid and took it to heart. </3 Lol, never wore it again. [I did wear it once again recently & Mom + Sisters were shocked. . . . ] Hehe!

[Nazifa Jan]

@Didem:

My prayers are with your people. (I tend to stay away from the news or any social networking site, so I was a lost person about it all. )
InshAllah [God willing], everything will be fine and everyone will be safe.
Take care, Didem.

[FarahN]

I bet u look good in shalwar kameez Nazifa. u have to wear it when we all meet up I wanna c!!

[FarahN]

Didem...
Oh Mann! I'm so sorry to hear this. I've been busy and haven't watched any international news. I really hope and pray that everything settles down soon and that everyone comes out of it safe and well.
Please take care of yourself. My prayers r with u and your country..

[didem]

Thank you very much. We need every prayer we can get. As I hear it, the situation is worse right now. Police attacks, protesters resist all around the country. Prime Minister doesn't hear us or he doesn't care. He brushes the situation aside and talks about other, minor stuff. I hope it settles down soon, too. People are exhausted and hurt.

[FarahN]

hang in there babe..

[didem]

[didem]

[didem]

Wow Farah! It took me a really long time to read this fascinating message Especially the differences between the people's complexions and features! We are really different from each other here, too. But I don't think I can classify people's complexions according to their regions. I can say that the people from the east anatolian region are dark. Because they are Kurdish descendants, and they are normally dark skinned. But that's about it. You can find brunettes, red heads, blondes, blue/green/hazel/brown-eyed people anywhere. I normally find it similar to Americans since they are very mixed too.

Ahh, the Spanish inquisitons! In the past, the arranged marriages were common here too. The girls had been examined very throughly in those inquisiton durations but not the man. People didn't care about their daughters that much at those times. Girls were money to them. They had seen the dowry as the money their due for having and raising their daughter. Of course, not everybody was doing that. That was just the common approach...

[didem]

[Nazifa Jan]

[didem]

We do the Anatolian Folk Dance in mixed groups. Men and women all join in. But that would be the only difference I guess.

About the dowwry. Nope, the family was the receiving end of that bargain. As I've said before, girls weren't that much important to the families. The guests at the weddings gift the bride and the groom with gold bracelets, necklaces, quarter/half/full gold coins and money. At past, those gifts were the husbands' property. Now they use it together to build their lives together.

[FarahN]

Hey... Yeh didem there is a lot of difference in complexions but yeh mostly people are dark haired. Anyone who has a different hair colour definitely stands out. All through Pakistan :p

The concept of dowry is that the girls family gives the girl and the dowry too. The bride gift is given by the groom to the bride. But that's never a lot. These days though, many ppl are against dowry so things are getting better.

About the inquisitions, thank God the girls aren't put through the griller as much hehehehehe but poor boys.. Lol

Didem, Are things any better in turkey today? I read online but I wanna know an insider's viewpoint..

[FarahN]

Nazifa, a friend of mine got married in Dubai. He told me that they have to first go get married in the court and sign documents there. And after that they can show the papers and book the halls and have the party there... Even the henna ceremony and all has to happen after that court marriage...
Temme.. Is that how it goes generally for citizens or is it only for immigrants?

[didem]

[FarahN]

Oh mannnn... This sounds really rough I hurt for what your people are going through. Unfortunately it's the same in my country. They say democracy but they mean authoritarian rule :s you say anything against them and they beat u up or kill u... Or at least discredit u..
I really hope all this settles down soon..please be safe..

[didem]

[FarahN]

My prayers are with your countrymen..
You're right lets let this be a forum where u can come and relax and not talk about the problems that are normally preying on your thoughts.
But lastly before we end this topic o. The main forum, I just want to say that you did right by coming back from the protests early. It doesn't make u a coward or less of a gem. You are more use alive to your country and people than dead. If every single person who opposes dies fighting then There will be no one left to take up the flag and resume protesting. So I most definitely don't think any less of you.

[Nazifa Jan]

[FarahN]

Hahahahaha ok :p